This Ben Gordon thing is starting to irk me (a.k.a. Game Thread #32: Bulls vs. Phoenix Suns)
I know I keep moving the goalposts when it comes to assessing the Bulls, but facing Cleveland (it's kindof unfortunate that the Cleveland game was buried in a holiday weekend, because that was a great win) and facing Phoenix are two completely different 'tests'. Luckily because they're in a different conference, this is a test that doesn't really matter if the Bulls 'pass' or not.
But I'm hoping that the game stays close, because if so it'll be a fun an exciting game. While not as acclaimed as Phoenix, the Bulls do their share of high-paced-ball-movement-offense-things that can be especially effective against a poor defense. Unfortunately, the Suns are not a poor defense, they give up a lot of points because they drive the pace of the game so high, but in the pace-neutral society of the future they'd be recognized as pretty good. Especially with Hinrich being out of the game, the Bulls will have a tough time slowing down these guys, but maybe they can have some fun staying close through matching their scoring.
Of course, there is the distinct chance of a huge early deficit because Ben Gordon will be sitting on the bench.
This whole Gordon thing is driving me crazy, and likely isn't doing much for him either, since this catch-22 situation has his bench role being further cemented the better he plays. In my mind it's a complete disconnect between correlation and causation. Yes, Gordon has been playing better since he went to the bench. But I've yet to be convinced he's playing better because he's been coming off the bench. Even the token excuses that have been offered, such as the benefit of playing against other teams' bench players (lets bench Wallace too!), or him needing to watch the game before entering it (so can he start the second half then?) aren't really doing it for me. And it really makes me wish there was no such thing as the 6th man of the year, because now becoming a mutli-year recipient of that award is something to shoot for? How about becoming an all-star?
Of course, if you're a big Kyle Orton fan you likely point to the Bulls record during that time and figure: why change things? Well, if they're getting pounded by a Western Conference powerhouse tonight (my personal 4-0 in-attendance record will be tested tonight!) you will likely be thinking of ways for the Bulls to get better, their nice record be damned. And an easy way to start would be giving Gordon more than 30 minutes a night. He's gotten 35 the past two games with Hinrich out, but when the normal rotation returns I want superstition to get thrown out the window and the better players getting the minutes.
Blogging with the Enemy: The Rising Suns | Bright Side of the Sun | Suns@NBAWeblog.com
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I fear a big early deficit in this game
Enter Matt's BG dilemma. If the Bulls go down big in the first 3 minutes, will BG enter even if Thabo doesn't have 2 fouls? I would think so because scoring will be at a premium tonight.
by james@lifeinthecell on Jan 2, 2007 6:13 PM CST 0 recs
Foiled! Some links at least...
The Suns roll into the UC tonight for what I hope will be an exciting match-up. Skiles has been singing praises about this Suns team and for good reason: they're an awesome team... on a major hot streak having only lost two games in their last 20. Plus, the Suns have dominated the (L)Eastern Conference (11-1). With Amare making great progress and Nash (Lang over at Slamonline is calling him "The System" now, based on Skiles's gushing) putting together another MVP-type season, the Bulls are in for a battle tonight.
How will the Bulls deal with another super-athletic forward in Amare?
Can we make life difficult for Nash with Kirk out nursing his groin?
Will the our not-quite-as-dominant D be enough against the League's most explosive team?
Can Little Ben and Luol continue their hot scoring streak with the new (old) ball?
Tonight should be a great game. Go Bulls!
by paxson43 on Jan 2, 2007 6:18 PM CST 0 recs
Matt, we finally agree!
Suns are looking pretty rough this season, and should be a lock for the conference finals unless someone gets hurt. Amare just tries to jam everything within 10ft of the basket and I did not realize how polished his low post game is. Between him and Howard, I may go with Amare even though Howard is stronger and has excellent character.
by DannyRange on Jan 2, 2007 6:43 PM CST 0 recs
Shooting
Strangely enough, against the Cavs the Bulls snapped a string of 300+ games with a 3-pointer made. Luckily they didn't need it, but tonight against the high scoring Suns they will.
by james@lifeinthecell on
Jan 2, 2007 6:53 PM CST
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i disagree
Of course, we could just have matt attend every game. I am 1-1 this year, and 3-2 over the past 2 years;
by milesgmsu on
Jan 2, 2007 7:59 PM CST
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I don't mind Ben coming off the bench
My biggest concern with Thabo starting, which is acknowledgegly based on a single game, is that he could actually lose playing time because of mistakes. Those picky fouls, as well as turnovers and poor shot selection, are so much more noticeable right at the beginning of the game.
by wjb1492 on Jan 2, 2007 6:51 PM CST 0 recs
Hopeful but doubtful
While I see the current Bulls as one of the league's better teams (top 6 or 8), there are certain match-ups where they tend to get steamrolled. Usually it's against very athletic and skilled frontlines. They've pretty well caught up to the Cavaliers, Pistons and Heat, and possibly even passed them, but I still have my doubts about how they match up with the Mavericks, Spurs and Suns.
I'm excited, though. Like I said, I'd love for them to prove me wrong.
by jamestkirk on Jan 2, 2007 6:55 PM CST 0 recs
i'm afraid of the same
I think the bulls are the class of the east, but as many commentators (including the one above) have stated, were the bulls in the west, they would be fighitng for a playoff spot (my thgoughts are about 6 or 7 seed)
*I forgot to whip out the Live until after the circus trip...you can pin those losses on me
by milesgmsu on
Jan 2, 2007 8:02 PM CST
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I don't
As far as Ben goes I say try him at starting if he screws up put him back on the bench.
by sue369 on Jan 2, 2007 7:05 PM CST 0 recs
Jalen Rose and Eric Piatkowski will haunt us ; )
by GWKD on Jan 2, 2007 7:31 PM CST 0 recs
A lead by the suns
And they played last night! Let's hope Steve Nash is tired, tired, tired.
by KT on Jan 2, 2007 7:39 PM CST 0 recs
Tim plays for the Clips
by DannyRange on Jan 2, 2007 7:41 PM CST 0 recs
Yeah, that's why it's his ghost.
by wjb1492 on
Jan 2, 2007 7:46 PM CST
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Nash and Duhon both have 2 assists, 1st Q, 8 m
by GWKD on Jan 2, 2007 7:47 PM CST 0 recs
Duhon assist to Gordon!!!
by GWKD on
Jan 2, 2007 7:57 PM CST
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You're a genious, PaxJax
Seriously, this first quarter has gone better than I expected. Hope they keep it up.
by wjb1492 on
Jan 2, 2007 8:02 PM CST
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Not really,
by Paxson Jackson on
Jan 2, 2007 8:13 PM CST
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So far, East evening things up a bit tonight.
Orlando is about to beat the Clips, provided they can make a reasonable number of free throws and don't totally choke.
Bulls are more than holding their own so far in a game a lot of people thought would be a blow-out, and Philly is up on Denver 24-14 near end of 1st.
by wjb1492 on Jan 2, 2007 8:38 PM CST 0 recs
And for any Redick fans
JJ's line for the night- 8 min, 0-1 shooting, 1-2 FT, 3 fouls, and a bad pass inbounding TO with 4 seconds left and Magic up only 3.
But Orlando does hang on, in spite of JJ.
by wjb1492 on
Jan 2, 2007 8:46 PM CST
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The first half
by sue369 on Jan 2, 2007 8:44 PM CST 0 recs
Looks like we caught Phoenix
by wjb1492 on
Jan 2, 2007 8:51 PM CST
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So Du's now 0 for 6
by wjb1492 on Jan 2, 2007 8:59 PM CST 0 recs
gordon off the bench
So, why would you change it?
MPG APG PPG FG% 3PT%
As starter: 27 3.1 12.8 38.8 20
As Sub: 30 3.5 21.9 45.5 37.2
by dcarioca on Jan 2, 2007 9:28 PM CST 0 recs
Let's hope trend continues
by paxson43 on Jan 2, 2007 9:41 PM CST 0 recs
Damn
by SouthSideIrish on Jan 2, 2007 9:55 PM CST 0 recs
That really sucks.
by wjb1492 on Jan 2, 2007 9:56 PM CST 0 recs
They had
I hate losing.
by sue369 on Jan 2, 2007 10:01 PM CST 0 recs
Didn't get to see the game
by Freethefro on Jan 2, 2007 10:03 PM CST 0 recs
definately
If they went to him more he could've done even more damage...he had a great game.
by your friendly BullsBlogger on
Jan 2, 2007 10:18 PM CST
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That was nothing
by Big D on
Jan 2, 2007 11:22 PM CST
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ARGH!
damn it...........
So close.
by Bullschicago on Jan 2, 2007 10:40 PM CST 0 recs
Kirkless
We lost the game in the mid third and especially the early and mid fourth quarters when our offense fell to pieces. With Kirk in the game, we would have been OK. Duhon was open again and again. He just can't hit jumpers right now. I know everyone here seems to hate the guy, but he used to be able to knock down open shots. He's gotta get that straightened out somehow. I was impressed with Phoenix's D in the second half. Bulls played excellent D as well and that's why Phoenix was only just barely able to come back.
One question: I thought that if someone is fouled off the ball in the last two minutes of the game, the team that was fouled gets to pick who shoots (the no-hack-a-wilt policy). When Wallce was fouled, it was clearly off the ball. Did it count as a loose ball foul because Deng was in the process of shooting? Either way, that was a bummer.
I hate to say it, but this is a "moral victory". If Bulls can beat Nets and Pistons this week (Chauncey-less Pistons?), winning the conference looks to be a likely possibility...
One last thing --> Steve Nash is really freaking good. That three he canned from two steps behind the arc with Duhon right on him was damn impressive. But he made a ton of plays tonight.
by corey williams corey benjamin on Jan 2, 2007 11:19 PM CST 0 recs
moral victory
but it is worth pointing out that the Bulls would have been absolutely destroyed by the PHX the last couple years. So it's progress.
by GWKD on
Jan 2, 2007 11:51 PM CST
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how is it a moral victory
by hongydraw on
Jan 3, 2007 3:23 AM CST
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Steve Nash
by KT on
Jan 3, 2007 6:27 AM CST
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That's just a silly comment
by BrightSideoftheSun on
Jan 3, 2007 11:49 AM CST
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Amare was the diference in the 4th
by Big D on Jan 2, 2007 11:20 PM CST 0 recs
I agree
But give credit to Phoenix, they came out with a much better defense in the third. The Bulls were forced into many tough shots. Luol alone was shooting fade away jumpers because the Suns started using a switching defense, a la Minnesota.
In the second half the Bulls didn't have nearly as many open shots.
A credit to Gordon, he was hitting when we needed him to...he will be our go to guy. I'm trusting him now to take things over when we need it. The 1.5 second shot was just set bad execution.
Oh, and the Barbosa shot, it was just sick. Can't complain about it at all. He had a defender in his face, and he drained it. It made me wanna throw up, but at least we know we can hang with those guys.
by james@lifeinthecell on
Jan 3, 2007 2:27 AM CST
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like i said...
by hongydraw on
Jan 3, 2007 3:27 AM CST
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you've said that several times since the game
by your friendly BullsBlogger on
Jan 3, 2007 8:44 AM CST
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hate to steal paxjax's thunder
ANy half witted basketball fan would tell you never ever fould a 3 point shooter....ever...I would take barbossa with that shot every time....he's going to hit it 30-35% of the time....you foul him (being an 80% shooter) theres a 90% chance he at least ties it and a greater than 50% chance he hits all three
by milesgmsu on
Jan 3, 2007 8:49 AM CST
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big guy
As good as Ben Wallace was rebounding he isn't good enough to box out/account for 2 of the opposing team's big guys on the boards. That is why Amare tore us apart down low... in trying to run a little bit we were not putting a body on Amare to box him out. The guy is awesome don't get me wrong (even tho he got rejected by Noc which was sweet) but he really was just taking advantage of our lack of size/boxing out down low.
Couple bad calls or non calls on Noc. one charge he shoulda gotten but BG7 got called for the reach in and the foul called on Noc after Big Ben's missed free throw which was the game in my eyes cause Deng came down with that board. On that last one the camera angle wasnt the greatest so Chapu mighta fouled but i couldnt see it. Anybody else get a better look?
Not a moral victory, but the Suns did get "lucky" and if we do play them in the finals I'm not as scared as I was before this game. Yes I think we will make it to the finals and NO i did not just jinx them...seriously I didn't.
by Zac23 on Jan 3, 2007 12:32 AM CST 0 recs
ummm...
by Paxson Jackson on
Jan 3, 2007 12:54 AM CST
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I'm pretty sure the original comment was a joke
by your friendly BullsBlogger on
Jan 3, 2007 8:43 AM CST
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I'm pretty sure
by Paxson Jackson on
Jan 3, 2007 9:22 AM CST
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Big Guy?
by EdNealy on
Jan 3, 2007 10:31 AM CST
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i was at the game
by hongydraw on Jan 3, 2007 3:17 AM CST 0 recs
I can top this (but not bartman)
by milesgmsu on
Jan 3, 2007 8:43 AM CST
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I was at game five as well...
by SouthSideIrish on
Jan 3, 2007 8:54 AM CST
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i have only felt worse once in my life
by milesgmsu on
Jan 3, 2007 8:57 AM CST
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Bad Losses
That game vs. the Wizards was ridiculous. I went to the U2 concert there a month later, and even when the band was playing loud with the whole crowd screaming, the 2/3 full UC when Pargo hit that shot was even louder. And it was Game 5.
The roughest loss I've ever seen in person was Colorado at Michigan in '94. You know the play. The whole place was stunned. I was just staring straight ahead with a dumbfounded look on my face. I swear I could see fans on the other side staring right back at me with the same look. My friends and I walked the mile and a half back to our dorm and no one said a damn word the whole way.
by corey williams corey benjamin on
Jan 3, 2007 9:03 AM CST
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kings game
I think it's because the 16-3 streak had everyones hopes real high; while with the kings game we never knew what to expect
by milesgmsu on
Jan 3, 2007 9:13 AM CST
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No moral victory
Down the stretch, I'm curious why Skiles didn't substitute more for offense-defense. After the game, he seemed irked with Gordon for not defending Barbosa more aggressively on the game-winning shot, but it seems to me that the Bulls would have been better off having Thabo on the floor for the last Phoenix possession, especially with their length.
I continued to be frustrated by Duhon. He's a decent floor general, but I don't know that it's enough to overcome the fact that he's such a non-threat offensively himself. He doesn't drive much at all, and he can't hit the standstill three reliably. Last night, he had a wide open three from the corner that he visibly hesitated before passing it up. It seemed like he was afraid to take the shot.
by Theus got there first on Jan 3, 2007 7:52 AM CST 0 recs
at least the 'hawks won
by milesgmsu on Jan 3, 2007 8:56 AM CST 0 recs
I wonder
by sue369 on Jan 3, 2007 9:21 AM CST 0 recs
Turnovers = Difference
Them - 10
I get the feeling that Kirk is missed...
by colintj on Jan 3, 2007 9:34 AM CST 0 recs
Still a good game
This is interesting (from ESPN's Daily Dime):
On Leandro Barbosa's game-winning 3, Steve Nash used his left leg in a tripping movement to force Ben Gordon inside and give Barbosa the space he needed to pull the shot. Had Gordon not tried to avoid Nash's leg and allowed himself to be tripped, I'm not sure if the officials would have called the foul on Nash, although it was clear that he was a moving screener. "Stripes" hate to make game-deciding calls on off-the-ball actions.
Anyone notice this?
by Moses Taylor on Jan 3, 2007 10:09 AM CST 0 recs
Yea,
by Goostafer on
Jan 3, 2007 11:37 AM CST
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I'm not sure I agree with that analysis
I'm reading Jack McCallum's book right now and his statistical analysis shows that Steve actually gets fewer calls than the top 20 players in the league. So I certainly don't think he has the NBA in his pocket.
by BrightSideoftheSun on
Jan 3, 2007 12:02 PM CST
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looked like a trip to me
I agree, it looks "like Steve is trying to get in front of his defender to set the pick and he thinks he is late getting there"...so he sticks his leg out.
I'm sure the play wasn't drawn up for Nash to trip Gordon, but for whatever reason - and it really doesn't matter - he sticks his leg out.
The line between dirty and crafty is pretty thin...and it depends on who you're rooting for.
by jamestkirk on
Jan 3, 2007 1:24 PM CST
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He may get
by sue369 on
Jan 3, 2007 1:43 PM CST
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He Might
by Goostafer on
Jan 3, 2007 6:23 PM CST
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You know
by Option27 on Jan 3, 2007 10:35 AM CST 0 recs
The Bulls played awesome
I think Bulls fans should be excited about this team. Everyone thinks the Suns are an elite team and they've let several double-digit leads get away this year. Sometimes it happens to the best of teams.
If Kirk would have been in the game, I think the Suns wouldn't have had a chance to come back.
by BrightSideoftheSun on
Jan 3, 2007 12:05 PM CST
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I don't think they played well.
by Eddy Currys Broken Heart on
Jan 3, 2007 1:49 PM CST
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I thought they played great in the first half
by wjb1492 on
Jan 3, 2007 2:50 PM CST
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My Pet Theory as to why Gordon Does Not Start
Maybe this theory is wrong or kooky, but I'm just trying to get into Skiles mind here.
by GWKD on Jan 3, 2007 2:00 PM CST 0 recs
The caption
by sue369 on
Jan 3, 2007 3:34 PM CST
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